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You'd think that after all of the deceit, the lies, the swindles, the cons and the rip-off's that one of these SOB's would be "pushing up daisies" and yet, not one these thieves has had any violence committed or directed against themselves (at least that we know of, so far). While I don't condone violence per-se, should something like that happen, especially to one of these future casualties currently posing as some Wall Street investment banker, I could at least UNDERSTAND why someone would commit such an act. Steal my money/property/identity to where I have nothing left and I PROMISE that I will have the last word when we discuss the matter at some point in the future at MY leasure.
I know, I know talk is cheap. But I'm reminded of the movie "V" For Vendetta and at the particular joy the "masked devil" seems to feel about having his way with government servants types that did unspeakable crimes when they crossed his path earlier in life.
How many more scandles and crimes are these fraudster criminal bankers and government types going to commit until someone takes matters into their own hands similarly like the movie just mentioned?? While a Hollywood thriller about political betrayal/intrigue is high on the make believe graphics and underlying political thoughts, we can at least dream (about it), can't we??
After all, every one of our financial problems that ails us as a country are the result of fraud and other criminal behavior committed by Wall Street and condoned by their fraudster brethren in the government. Every last one of them...


We are at stage 4 according to Prof. Roubini's article :


America’s economy risks mother of all meltdowns

Step 5 should be meltdown of commercial property and we'll see how well the monoline insurers are going to hold up.


Stupid, dumb, layman's question: If all of this "paper" at question is as worthless as Monopoly money, why can't Mom just yell out, "Pack in the game kids. Suppers ready." If the paper doesn't really represent anything, why does it have to be bailed out? Why not just game over, start again from zero tomorrow?

As I understand, we're talking about trillions of dollars of paper that has no actual worth. No value. No import. So why is it significant? Why can't the lot of worthless receivables and payables just be swept off the table in tandem?

I used an online conversion table the past few days: Friday, 1 Canadian dollar bought $0.99 US; today it bought $1.01 US. Plus or minus a penny yes, but a big swing over a weekend. Why invest in a US issue if the $ value is falling and inflation is rising? Do the Chinese have similar reservations?

Your comments would be appreciated.


Hi Allen/Vancouver,

Imagine you yourself convinced the US Congress to allow you to start a bank and whenever you got some poor sucker to sign a 'loan' for $500,000 you got to put that in your ledgers as new 'money' that your bank created.

You then get to earn 5% per year on that, or $25,000 MORE money that comes from the poor sucker's hard labor pumping gas, selling insurance other real work.

How often would you want to do this?

When the people could not pay, would you want the 'money' you created out of thin air to go away, or would you want to convince the congress to protect your 'money' with the taxing power of the IRS (and US Military)?

Would you make want to require big down payments that would reduce the number of loans you could create, or want no down payment to let you create more?

Would you want to keep these loans in your bank and try to collect them, or sell them off to someone else and get most of the benefit of the loan now?

Could you convince more people to create more loans if the interest rates was really low for 5 years then changed to whatever you wanted in the future?

Now that you have this power to create money, would you consider trying to convince the government schools to not teach people about debt?

Do you think your power to create virtually unlimited amounts of money might eventually start making things cost more money aka. inflation?

Would you consider using some of your newfound wealth to subsidize top university professors to teach this money creation process as economic theory?

Do you think money is a public good like roads, defense, health, or is it a private good like bananas and coal that the free market should be able to create at will?

Did your country fight a revolutionary war with Britain to gain the right to print your own money instead of using King George's currency?

Does you constitution strictly restrict the coining of money as an essential task of congress and the treasury?

You might ask, what happens if someone withdraws the funds from my precious bank to buy a house from someone who deposits the money in your creepy neighbors bank? That is why they invented the inter-bank loan process, and the federal reserve (a private company like federal reserve) to loan you the money if none of your creepy neighbor bankers would.

Once you master the art of running your bank, would you want to become the central banker?

What if your customers country became fairly wealthy and generated enough of their own capital from hard work to not need your loans? Would you consider taking all their money they they deposited with you and loaning it to an Asian country with slave labor wages and an iron-clad guarantee that non-payers would be executed at will?

Would you consider getting China to lend the United States as much money as they needed to buy the stuff created with all that money to help pay your interest rate?

Would you consider using the $1 trillion in US debt as a bargain tool to prevent trade barriers if the US peasants started to revolt over their loss of jobs and new loan money?

Would you ever be tempted to restrict credit to your US customers and make it hard for them to get money to pay interest and have them default on their loans so you get to repo their houses, farms and businesses?

Would you want to provide credit cards debt money at 10%, 15, 20 or 30% interest instead of that stinky old 5% you were getting before?

Would you? Or would you be nice and play fair like a good little trooper?

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Minor nations can go bankrupt and there is a disturbance in the force. But when major empires go bankrupt, there is total chaos, political, economical as well as social. Revolutions and world wars.

So there is a lot at stake. The US not going bankrupt is very important to global society.

Blunt Force Trauma

The best part of this 'bailout' is that if it does happen, it will happen whilst being buried by the lamestream media presstitutes who are making no mention of this AT ALL.

I've 'Googled' the hell out of this and found....NOTHING.

Let the banks crash, die, falter, what-have-you.

If the banks want help, recalling of all those millions in bonuses and stock options that were given to CEOs and the like should be their very first call to action.

A drastic cut in pay to those higher-ups would be a good start as well.

Public money is not the solution in this scenario. Gads, it stuns me to think of the infrastructure that could be obtained with this money or healthcare or using it to build more affordable housing or perhaps used to ease the pain of $18 a bushel of wheat and rising food prices. Geez, maybe for all of the above(?).

Stop the planet. Let me off.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Yup. Get the money back. But to do this, we must invade the Queen of England's many damn pirate islands. Which is Tuesday's story, of course.


1) You cannot win
2) You cannot break even
3) You cannot leave the game.
These are the three basic laws of thermodynaics.
4) You cannot get something for nothing, unless you own a bank and can print money.
5) There is no such thing as a free lunch; the beers cost a nickel each. ( For the young'uns; during the last depression, saloons advertized FREE LUNCH with the purchase of a beer. No buy a beer no get a free lunch. The beers cost a nickel each and the one thing in abundance on the bar were salted peanuts. Two things brough the USA out of its last depression, 1) the repeal of the You cannot drink amendment. This created a whole new legal industry for the states and feds and localities to tax.
2) The finagling of the USA into the global war. Prior to Pearl Harbour, the arms export industry was doing only OK. Not a big enough boost to jump start the economy, England had a small army to sell/give stuff to.
Elaine and many others use the 7 years of Bush2 as the period of evil in banking and finance. Yet she knows that the period of evil really started in 1913 and has continued uninterrupted. The Graham Leech Brierly act of 1999 codified the crap we face now,
It was one in a long line of governmental screwups, just as was the S&L bailout, the Chrysler Bailout, Clinton's pushing through the media consolidation bills, Clinton's DOJ going all anti-trust on Microsoft in 1999, which predated the busting of the dotcom bubble by about 2 weeks.
The saddest thing is that we have supported this through almost 6 generations now ( if you count a generation as 18 years).
We have nibbled each other to death. Voted in clowns and sons of clowns and friends of clowns and each time we have persuaded ourselves that this time it will be better, this crew will be the serious ones, this crew will be mature so we don't have to be.
But them talking head babes on the financial cable shows sure are purty, and they sure do talk all loud and over each other.


Imagine an illegal poker game in full swing with a huge stack of chips in front of all the players and a large pot in the middle. This game (the world banking system) has been playing for many hours with various draws having been made on the house bank because the game is soooo stimulating and the stakes have risen so high.

Now suppose a drunken bar keep (insert the name of your favorite politician here)stumbles into the room with a platter of drinks and crashes into the table, sending all the chips flying. Who is going to resolve this fiasco amiably and fairly? Who will adjudicate the various disagreements over who had what amount of chips or what bets were make? Unless cooler, wiser heads prevail........

Here at home, the US could establish a separate currency for internal use so American business could still operate with multi-national companies locked out from participating in American commerce. Tough medicine. International settlements would be handled by a renewed and honest Treasury, assuming no Federal Reserve. Lop-sided trade balances, or most trade balances could be settled by barter of goods. How about $60/bushel wheat for, say, $200/barrel oil (basis FRN's) on the international market. Barter would determine the true potential wealth of each country whereas FRN's don't. As for international debt obligations, cancel them all...still better than going to war. Remember, it was an illegal poker game all along.


That cancelling idea sounds good, until you think it through from the other guys point of view. He loaned you a lot of money and now you are saying FU bud we are out of here. In the old days, countries tried this and found out that no one would trade with them except for real items. No promises, no promisory notes, no paper. Stuff for stuff. Unfortunately, we don't make stuff anymore; we make paper. So with no stuff to trade, no one ships us coffee or oil or chrome or LNG or lumber or motherboards or any of the other things the country needs to keep on keeping on. Would the rest of the world suffer? Not as much as one might think. The world is currently doing as much as it can as quickly as it can to decouple their economies from ours. Greenspan was in Saudi Arabia yesterday telling the sheiks that they would be smart to unpeg their currencies if they want to avoid the long run inflation they are already importing from the USA. If the Saudis and the gulf states depeg. That means that they will have to lose the convenience of using the $ as the oil currency but they will also stop that 10% a year loss they have to take every year as the dollar buys less and less. With the $ no longer necessary for oil transactions ( rubles, euros, yen and yuan will replace it ), the dollars floating about the world will tumble in value and they will all start being sent home---to the only place they are legal tender---to purchase farmland, highways, dams, open space, forests, whatever remains that is real value within the USA. The foreign countries will appreciate the farmlands, expecially after the American farmers are evicted.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Isn't Greenspan funny? HAHAHA.

I will write about that creep later. Had to write about gold, first.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Isn't Greenspan funny? HAHAHA.

I will write about that creep later. Had to write about gold, first.


"With the $ no longer necessary for oil transactions ( rubles, euros, yen and yuan will replace it ), the dollars floating about the world will tumble in value and they will all start being sent home---to the only place they are legal tender---to purchase farmland, highways, dams, open space, forests, whatever remains that is real value within the USA. The foreign countries will appreciate the farmlands, expecially after the American farmers are evicted."

And where will the Americans be??? In foreign labor camps in other countries, that's where!! X-(


If you own the land why would you need the people? I mean look at most americans in the malls, on the highways, in their mcdonalds, now tell me what possible use do you find for them? Economically, slaves at least have to be able to produce more than they consume. Take the entire population of the upper floors of wall street, what conceivable physical value could they produce? Useless eaters.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

We are the consumer nation.


We are the CURRENT consumer nation. There are a few Indians and a few more Chinese who would enjoy consuming at even half our current levels.


I love your stuff, but Hitler was a CORPORAL, not a colonel!

Keep up the good work.

Paul S

The S&L crowd were pikers compared to the current crop of thieves. This sub prime scandal is a perfect example of why the US is flushing down the toilet. The "bankers" who caused this mess AND the members of the Banking and Finance Committees in Congress should go to prison and serve LONG terms. I'm not talking about the 'country club' style prisons either. And yet, the managers at Morgan Stanley insist the deserve their huge pay bonusses(!!). There is no limit to the arrogance of this country's ruling class. I guess I can't blame them; they have been getting away with it forever. Not to worry though. Our current President Bush claims he sees that the economy is weak. No kidding Sherlock? Well you have finally found your legacy Mr. Bush: you are more corrupt than your daddy. Nice legacy.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

100% correct, Paul..arrest them all.

home loan mortgage calculator

For over a period of time of paying your mortgage on a timely basis, you will see that the equity will build up. You need to understand that the equity is a financial asset which you can use as collateral when taking out loans in the future. For manufactured or mobile home equity, you will see that the equity loans can be as high as 85% or even 100% of the total value of the equity on the home. This means that you can have access to most of your home’ s equity.


lmmc, 'have access to most of your homes equity' .. that is HILARIOUS!

You are of course away that peasants having any equity unencumbered by debt is DEFINITELY NOT in the interests of the bankers.

If you have 100,000 of equity and no debt, you have 100,000 of network and the banks make NO REVENUE.

If you 'have access' to 100% of your equity and take out a 100,000 home equity loan, you have a NET WORTH OF ZERO!

You are a RENTER FOR 30 YEARS TO YOUR FEUDAL MASTER. Can I assume that you have studied feudal history of europe? Or did you go to US government school?

Now, let's scale up your brilliant example to the USA. Let's say to the asset value of all our stock market is $12 trillion and the value of all our housing stock is $12 trillion as well.

Our countries total net worth is $24 trillion.

Interestingly enough, if we have $12 trillion of government debt and $12 trillion in home 'owner' (bank-renter) debt, OUR COUNTRIES NET WORTH IS ZERO!

Voila. Bankers rule. Game Over peasant. Go back to work.

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