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Simon

Well said, here is another interpretation:

Gollum: I want your money. 700B. Give it to me precious, NOW.
Voter: Hell no we won't pay!
Congress Critter: You heard the people

Next day:
Gollum: Market go weeeeeeeeee!!
Voter: OMG, my 401k, my IRA, my savings

And the next day:
Gollum: See precious? Consequences happen...
Senate Critter: Ok, ok! Vote the damn bill in!

To be fair, Japanese also tried to pick bottoms in the 80s, ended badly with a lot of illiquid skyscrapers ;)

Elaine Meinel Supkis

HAHAHA. You posted before my cartoon went up. Note how my dear gnome character plays his darling games.

Simon

Your cartoon is hilarious and sharp, I should try to get as many people to see it as possible :)

Note the key words in their statements
student loans, 401k, families, ordinary people pension. These muppets must work for Google or Yahoo!

"Sure, its for de Children!"
I hope the rapid bounce of the Dow reminds everyone what a joke this is, however the sinking feeling is that they are already 'saving' the market by stealth.
Everything is getting surreal

carli

Actually a lot of that skyscraper business was monkey business tax evasion by Japanese who were getting cheap loans against their inflated Tokyo property, buying up "cheap" US property, paintings, jewelry, and other hard assets at "very overpriced" amounts, in collusion with the sellers.

This is how they could convert the properties they held into serious cash without selling them and having to pay huge capital gains taxes, and evade taxes at home. The rates prior to 2006 were over 50% on capital gains.

By the time the Japanese property bubble had crashed the smart money had already doubled, tripled, quadrupled their money. Of course, they also used the crash to reflect losses on their balance sheets to forgo income tax, having made big gains in their laundered capital gains from those loans. They made money cutting both ways.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Correct, Carli. Note how the upperclasses in Japan are totally recapitalized, long ago. They are now on a buying spree.

Simon

Incidentally today is also a magic day, I'll let you all guess what it is.
The sky has not fallen, don't start panic yet
There were bargain to be had yesterday, wish I had insider knowledge like Mr Charity and Mr Gates et al

calvino

"Hundreds of billions of dollars are going to bail out FOREIGN INVESTORS. They know it, they demanded it, and the bill has been carefully written to make sure that can happen." - Brad Sherman , D-California"

Further, Sherman says that the Secretary of the Treasury will veto a bill that restricts assets to American ownership or even American soil. Hat tip to Denninger for the alert.

Dennis Kucinich was on the Rachel Jewdow show today and demanded a bottom up funding of the system. Call him to support him - it means a lot. Now DrMengele, since Rachel Jewdow does not celebrate Rosh Hashana, you won't gas her? Go to Arlington and take a knee in front of a Star of David, and to the Normandy American Cemetery as well. Then tell them that Rosh Hashana is not an American holiday, you stinking piece of shit. Good donors you got.

Simon

As long as the Japanese people are willing to place themselves under virtual indentured servitude the elites will always float.
World War II horrors and the lean years make this a picnic for most of them.

Karmaisking

On to other matters: One of the very few times I will admit to being confused. Why is the US dollar going up against the Euro and Swiss franc in the midst of this madness? The absolutely corrupted, debauched US Congress is preparing to splatter billions and billions all over the place and yet the currency is going up. What the Hell is going on?

calvino

Simon, the working Japanese dream of escaping their island prison. When they come here to the USA, they can not stop saying how much easier their life has become. And they say that while holding regular jobs, like the rest of us. As Mrs. Supkis said, 'the Japanese are up in arms.' No they are not. They have never been allowed to arm themselves, not even with cutting weapons. That is why you have completely failed people running around their Fifth Avenue in Tokyo, slashing whomever and screaming 'I want to die'.

calvino

Karma, the Swiss are buying dollars in a deal to stave off tax evasion charges for UBS and Credit Suisse. That would blow up their eight hundred year old enterprise of money laundering. It is a cheap deal for them. Short eur/chf - it is going to the same place, but safer.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Calvino, you are correct about this being a high holy day for Jewish people which is like Xmas for non-Jews, for example.

On the other hand, if we were in a terrible crisis, one would thing that MERE HOLIDAYS WOULDN'T MATTER. People would stay around to see it through, not run off for Xmas or Thanksgiving or whatever holiday I can name, religious OR secular!

This is a clue that this terrible mess isn't so awful.

Pluto

Today is also a very special day. It is the first time in US history that armed combat troops -- a batallion -- are being deployed
inside the United States in many major cities. They will even have tanks and heavy artillary.

It's for our own protection, of course. In case our neighbors turn out to be civil disobedients. If we get too uppity, they may call off the election until everyone settles down.

You can read about it in Army Times.

Simon

I think this mess is pretty horrible but not in the way we think, in terms of finance etc
This would be a feint.
Just think, if the elites really knew a crisis is looming, would they constantly advertise it for everyone to see in plain sight?
I think this mess has completely distracted everyone from the oncoming election and the policies to be set in the next four years.
Everyone seem to be in a rush to push things through congress, creating fait accompli for the government.

OC

Pluto,

Read my last post:

De ja vu: Yeltsin orders tanks to crush protesters in Russia...wonder which foreign country or countries is pulling the strings this time???

OC

Pluto,

Read my last post:

De ja vu: Yeltsin orders tanks to crush protesters in Russia...wonder which foreign country or countries is pulling the strings this time???

OC

Blunt Force Trauma and Buffalo Ken,

Better factor in the black ops too. The tanks and army might be just the start of the slide.

Remember Beslan and Chechen terrorist bombings in Moscow?? Targetting of dissidents and reporters?? We all could be on the shit list by now!!

JT

"Collective fear stimulates herd instinct, and tends to produce ferocity toward those who are not regarded as members of the herd."
- Bertrand Russell -

JT

"There is nothing to fear except the persistent refusal to find out the truth, the persistent refusal to analyze the causes of happenings."
- Dorothy Thompson -

Firt one for OC and second one in honor of Elaine.

You have to ask why; what would be the motive.
Elaine has a gift. She not only checks the facts, she also can read the people in power and she´s not afraid to think for herself (why somenone says something is far more interesting than what someone says especially in politics). She´s fearless.
The motives are far more macabre and stupid than we give the people of power credit for.

carli

That's right Elaine, The Japanese have the money. Getting nuked twice in a week, after offering peace and surrender has to be one of the greatest motivating forces for any race. They are great survivors.

They are now going heavy into India. China they are well positioned. The Japanese government has given soft loans for infrastructure to India totaling $23.4 Billion since 2003. With earmarks of $1.8 Billion in 2007-08. The private sector has come in with much, much more in investments.

They are very much moving to unite Asia under a single currency first, then into a Federation of States, after the EU collapses back into individual states with the Euro collapse, which will follow the dollar.

I sincerely wish this is not so, but unless the US government enacts the solutions you and a few others like Denninger have brought forward, then the meltdown and bankruptcy of the US will be a fait accompli. It is just a matter of time now. You and I, and all of us here know they are not going to do it. Well, maybe through an act of God?

Calvino, the Swiss are history. The new financial haven will be Singapore, and to a lesser degree Hongkong. When the Swiss allowed themselves to be conned into the Wall Street Investment bank Ponzi scheme they lost all sense of credibility, and respectability. I know many people who HAD large, no, HUGE, accounts with them. People from Asia. They have ALL, everyone I know personally, liquidated their accounts and brought everything back to Asia. Which would very much have contributed to the LIBOR rate hitting historic highs since Monday.

Right now the name of the game is wealth preservation, not speculation. In fact, the smart money is already doing medium-long term plays, in Asia. This will become more apparent as the dust settles and everyone sees the futility of the Fed and the City's actions.

Trust in the US & EU is next to nil. It's difficult to swim in a pool where sharks of the same species eat even their own. One only does this if one has no choice. That illusion has since evaporated.

OC

JT,

Not fear; anticipation. with that, preparation for what that is to come.

Carli,

They will be based in Oz but u are right; Singapore and Hongkong will be the next Switzerland and Lichtenstein; Macao the new Monaco and Shang Hai the next New York.

carli

Latest Denninger, The truth about the bailout:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqIFoBXGizc

One thing I can say about this is, that the Philippines and India have little or next to no exposure liability in the US subprime and mortgage loan debacle. Both countries will not benefit from the Bailout Bill.

Buffalo Ken

Note: A bit of a rambling and off-topic post here, but I did see my name mentioned so here goes...

In the 20th century (like so many before) it was one war after another. Empires collapsed and new ones emerged. New technlogies for ever escalating war were discovered in the name of "national military interests" (as opposed to technologies that might serve the common interest and be much more broadly useful). Far off lands were plundered and many People essentially enslaved. You know - sort of like history repeating whats been going on for the last 4000-5000 years or so during which time "Mars" has been on a rampage.

It seems to me that one outcome of this is that many in the elder generation today who were compelled to fight in these wars know nothing but subservience to the Nation-State and they are easy prey for the media manipulators and other malicious sorts of whom there are so many. Sad in a way because much of what they thought they were fighting for is turning out to be nothing but a mirage. All their effort was for naught as is almost always the case with WAR. They were the "playthings" of the so-called elite, but of course, when you are young, "WAR" and "pretty French maidens" can be exhilerating in a sick and twisted sort of way. Go figure.

If "Mars" isn't balanced-off mighty soon then I think we can kiss our asses goodbye --- all of us - literally. So I really don't give a flip if I end up in some prison camp (Soviet style) or worse - I refuse to shut up and I do not abide fear. If "they" are hauling asses off to camps, I suspect our collective fate will be sealed given all of the ecological inbalances for which the time to respond is rapidly diminishing. Don't we have better things to do and ain't it obvious we are at the precipice or for a more pleasant word "the crossroads". Its big time decision time and willful ignorance is no excuse. Large-scale decisions made in bloated self-interest are a crime against humanity.

What would Jesus do? Huh all you Christians out there. Really - what did Jesus say about WAR. Do you have an answer or are you the worst sort of hypocrite.

I think some in my generation know better and many in the next generation know better. In my generation's youth we witnessed "bullets to the brain" for many of the country's best leaders (thanks George you fucker). We witnessed how war damaged the psyche. Many of us wanted no part of it - we wanted something better.

My hope lies with wisdom that remains with a few in the elder generation, some in my generation who refuse to "play the war game", and many in the next generation who will have to bear the brunt of so many poor misguided decisions. My hope lies with the fact that humanity can in theory rapidly make massive changes in lifestyle (in one or two generations...) Here is another site that I find hopeful. For me, it speaks of a better time from the past.

http://ancientgreece-earlyamerica.com/

Please let me know if you disagree with what I have posted above or if you think I am over-generalizing or am lost in space. I am still trying to learn, but I have sort of concluded that the so-called elite pyramid is due for a massive flipping or humanity is due for extinction. Those who thought they were near the pinnacle will discover otherwise and instead of striving towards some sort of singularity pinnacle where a few are "crowned" at the top, the former base of the pyramid could become a new shape with many at the top and everyone working together. I suspect many of todays so-called "elite" will become "un-elite" and discover the inviolate law of Karma. Good riddance as far as I'm concerned because they are not leaders. They are self-absorbed destroyers and I'm sick of it.

Peace,
Ken

Buffalo Ken

Here is a dream:

"Nurenburg 2"

I want to better understand why it was concluded that "following orders" is not an excuse. I'm not so sure at least when "scale" is taken into consideration. The focus for now needs to be on the large-scale offenders.

End of dream.....

carli

Princeton: Crisis on Wall Street Panel Discussion
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wj_JNwNbETA

Princeton economists review recent events on Wall Street and assess the implications for the economy and public policy.

Panelists:

- Hyun Shin, Professor of Economics and associate chair of the Department of Economics;
- Markus Brunnermeier, Professor of Economics;
- Harrison Hong, Professor in Finance;
- Paul Krugman, professor of economics and international affairs;
- Alan Blinder, Professor of Economics and Public Affairs and co‐director of the Center for Economic Policy Studies.

Blunt Force Trauma

Good morning and Happy October.

You won't believe where that $700-billion bailout figure came from (LA Times)

'"It's not based on any particular data point," a Treasury spokeswoman told Forbes.com Tuesday. "We just wanted to choose a really large number."

They made it up to be sufficiently ginormous to frighten everyone into rapid action'

Full article:

http://tinyurl.com/4uvgqu

Bear of Little Brain

Off-topic, but good for the soul, Ken. Thanks for the link.

Blunt Force Trauma

Hey, OC.

This one's for you. It's 2 1/2 hours long. The first 20 minutes will do.

http://tinyurl.com/46jdjs

Bear of Little Brain

BFT:
Yeah, yeah. I did that $700Bn yesterday. Is this telepathy? Omm…
;-)

Re: Denninger. One thing to bear in mind is that a lot of this toxic debt was sold by Wall Street to overseas investors, so it's not black and white. There again the Fannie/Freddie stuff clearly stated that it did not have government backing. And there's Deputy Dawg Frank and his gay lover at Fannie, courtesy of WRH…
http://tinyurl.com/5xf4b6

Blunt Force Trauma

I just love it, Bear.

We needed a really big number to scare everyone. Oh, and then we pretty much repeated 1907 by having the DOW crap out on Monday to scare them into this bill/bailout or what I call the "final seizure of power by the banking families that own and run the Federal Reserve".

Bear of Little Brain

Trichet now insisting that the Bailout Bill be passed. I can smell the fear.

Bear of Little Brain

BFT:
Re: 1907 panic. I read somewhere that the US president (Coolidge?) in 1905(?) wanted to break up all the industrial monopolies. Maybe there is a connection.

Blunt Force Trauma

I wonder if Bear posetd this one as well...

As is being discussed in Britain with their banking bill....

FDIC wants to raise deposit insurance limit: source (Reuters)

The S&L debacle began when the Bush (elder) administration raised the maximum insurable savings and loan account from $10,000 to $100,000. That set the stage for the huge rape of the American taxpayer yet to come!

History repeats.

That is what is wrong with history.

http://tinyurl.com/5yu6js

Bear of Little Brain

BFT: From JS Mineset
Every time history repeats itself the price goes up.
--Unknown Author

OC

Blunt Force Trauma,

Now I know why Buddha want to get off - he's finally caught on and he wants out at all costs!!

Blunt Force Trauma

Jean-Claude, eh, Bear? I wonder what his "cut" of the action will be IF the "rescue" goes through?

Blunt Force Trauma

Hmm, I wonder why the DOW isn't up 'in anticipation that the bailout will pass'; as the media says.

The DOW is down, for now, only 66 points to 10,774.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

I once had to tame a horse. Sparky would buck and kick. He would jump in the air, He shook from side to side. Then he rolled on the ground only I slid onto his stomach and then back to his back when he jumped up again.

So he RAN INTO A TREE. I tied his reins around the tree as we both were now stuck in that tree! He couldn't jump, buck or run!

BOY WAS HE PISSED. He tried to bite my foot but couldn't reach it. So he stood there for an hour with his ears back.

Finally he sighed and I said, 'Hey, why don't you just go to where I want to go and we will both be happy,'


He never bucked again.

Bear of Little Brain

Apologies, everyone, for being too lazy to check (see post above). Theodore Roosevelt was President 1901-1909. He broke up the railroad and oil monopolies of Morgan and Rockerfeller.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidency_of_Theodore_Roosevelt

The Panic of 1907 begins to fall into place…

Bear of Little Brain

Reality bites:
ISM manufacturing Index: 43.5 Expected: 49.5
Below 50 is contraction
Construction spending for August: no change on July, BUT July revised down from -0.6% to -1.4%

Senator Aproxmire

Funny thing about the capital gains tax if it get eliminated: that does not apply to the schmucks with 401Ks and IRAs who want to exit the system. THEY will still have to pay taxes on the whole thing based as ordinary income, not capital gains, and with a 10% penalty to boot!

GK

Sparky = Taxpayer

R

Elaine,

You may enjoy this Marcy Kaptur video - THEY WANT MAMA TO MAKE IT ALL BETTER!

B.A.

I used to be skeptical about financiers and their magic beliefs, but a 777.7 drop... wow

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