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John Savage

"...the opposite side of time rather than 'back' in time..."

interesting. care to elaborate?

Elaine Meinel Supkis

If the universe is contracting, so to speak, we aren't looking "into the past" when we see severely red-shifted galaxies, we are seeing the opposite side of the previously expanded universe that is no longer moving away from us, I suspect.

This is why those galaxies aren't 'young'.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

I am only guessing, of course. Explaining all this very 'at odds' data is a huge challenge for scientists. But first, they have to admit they can't figure this out. Previous assumptions are wrong since none of them take into account the fact that galaxies are all, everywhere, falling into each other's gravitational pools.


Starting from that fact, all other data has to explain itself.

John Savage

but the speed of light is constant, regardless of the motion of the observer...or the source.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Sort of, we are assuming this, of course.


The problem is, where is the light traveling? Straight lines? Or curved? And if space is warped and light follows the curvature of space, how does that affect our perception of light here on our own galaxy?


Something isn't right. The data coming in doesn't fit the model at all.

John Savage

so if i gaze at a galaxy 13 billion light-years away, and in that 13 billion years space has stopped expanding and that severely red-shifted galaxy is now actually moving towards me, why is it that i see a red-shifted galaxy moving away from me? where is the light that reveals that it is actually moving towards me?

JSmith

"where is the light that reveals that it is actually moving towards me?"

If it's heading toward you, it should be blue-shifted.

JSmith

And you can still have local collisions between gravitationally-attracted bodies while space continues to expand. Nothing contradictory about that at all.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Everywhere, the same 'local' collisions? Huh? What?


As far we we can tell, there is no place in space galaxies are NOT colliding or sucking in everything!


About redshift: if ALL OTHER DATA CONTRIDICTS IT, something is WRONG! Shoehorning everything into an old shoe won't fix it.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

Indeed, one should expect the 'falling into each other' to be happening a lot long ago and almost never now but it isnt!


It is happening now....TO US! We are catching up with Andromeda, not flying away at right angles (if the expanding universe were a big balloon),


And poor Andromeda and us, we are falling towards the Great Attractor which got its name because of what it is doing to us. And that monster isn't all the 'local' at all: the 'Local Group' is local.

Or maybe everyone is loco. Heh.

Elaine Meinel Supkis

I will buy a balloon tomorrow and take pictures illustrating how this all works. How the Great Attractor can be 'red shifting' even as we get closer and closer (IT IS MOVING TOO! But we are catching up over the next billions of years!).

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